OMG Politics, I'm over it already.

Status
Not open for further replies.
We don’t have to do much to convince them. Just let them have what they voted for. They’re want to burn their own towns and salt the earth. A trade war with China, trying to revive fossil fuels, and deporting cheap farm labor are going to devastate rural America, and no amount of school prayer will bring it back. We need to focus on building up the cities and coastal states and get the party ready for Trump’s rural backers inevitably realizing that they got conned.
Yep.
Jobs won't come back.
Wall won't get built.
Millions will lose health insurance (and there will be no replacing the ACA--it'll just go back to the way it was).
America's standing in the world community will be devastated.
Trump will line his own pockets, and those of his cronies.
Washington gridlock will continue.
Midterms, here we come.
 
@eloydrummerboy ...which is why Congress members have staff, who get the documents they need to read to fully understand the matter at hand.
You willing to take your entire savings and put it in a company of your choosing, then allow me to pick Joe America to be the CEO, but I'll promise you he'll have a great staff?

Maybe you are. And I would agree he probably wouldn't necessarily ruin the company. But he might. I personally wouldn't take that risk.

Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk
 
Yep.
Jobs won't come back.
Wall won't get built.
Millions will lose health insurance (and there will be no replacing the ACA--it'll just go back to the way it was).
America's standing in the world community will be devastated.
Trump will line his own pockets, and those of his cronies.
Washington gridlock will continue.
Midterms, here we come.

But this is all OK as long as we don't express our anger and hatred about our elected leaders.
 
Thanks for directly insulting me as a git.


Jello,
I have met you a few times and we have had political conversations. You claim to be independent, but you are clearly right leaning. So please don't try to pass yourself off as impartial.
I guess you have a problem of wrapping your head around the idea that it is ok to hate racists and misogynists. In fact, it does not make you as bad as them. Hating someone because they have more pigment in their skin or because they have a vagina is wrong. Hating people because they want to strip rights from people for arbitrary reasons, is not bad. And while yes, that map is very red, the population in those red spots is very small or Trump would have won the popular vote. He is only president because of the electoral college he so despises.
Gits was unintentional and I apologize for it...I typed guys, or so I thought...

Yes I do lean a little right, but I deplore racism and sexism as much as you...but I also deplore the condescension and arrogance I see from the left...

The left claims to be the enlightened side, but yet they, just like you guys, are not willing to consider things from another point of view...

Yes, Trump is a racist, xenophobic son of a bitch, and yes many if the people who voted for him are as well...you are never going to eradicate it, hatred is always going to exist...

But there is an adage used by religious people that is apropos here...they say "hate the sin, love the sinner"...but the left hates the sins AND the sinners...

Trump played the system masterfully...the left needs to push to change the system...

The map shows one important thing...it is an urban vs rural fight...the cities need the rural or you're going to starve to death, but the rural doesn't need to city to survive...they can feed themselves...so the left had better find a better way to appeal to them than this...
 
I have come to the conclusion that we really shouldn't be blaming trump. its like blaming a snake for biting you.

blame the DNC. they actually rigged the primary and put up a terrible candidate. they ran a horrible campaign. they deserved the loss. Hillary did not visit WI one time during the general. her unfavorable and untrustworthy numbers were godawful from the start. she sat back and focused on trump more than convincing people she was the one.
 
14947770_1234147889983605_1334782363433186386_n.jpg
 
Though I have a hard time with some of what Jello is saying, and cannot agree completely, I can also see some truth. Mostly, the DNC and Clinton campaign underestimated the feelings (not critical thought. the truly desperate are often beyond critical thought) of working class americans who feel left behind, and left out, and talked down to. Michael Moore got it right. Basically, they were a bit tone deaf. And whether or not there is truth in the "deplorable" comment, it did not help. I believe Bernie spoke to those people more, and with more compassion. Given hierarchy of needs consideration, I think there is more going on here than racism. Now, that doesn't mean that calling the racism out is not ok. And I still think that choosing to vote for Trump makes one complicit. But Trump effectively stoked the fears of a whole lot of disenfranchised people, and the DNC and Ms. Clinton did not effectively counter it. At least in those states where the electoral votes mattered most. I think the timing of the latest scandal "news" which amounted to nothing, hurt. But it hurt worse because Ms. Clinton and the DNC has been tone deaf on certain things and concerns. Even if there was technically a defense or explanation to each tarring, giving the opportunities for those tarrings shows a disconnect. And is also a part of the tone deafness, along with things like the "deplorable" comment.

PS, I am a huge admirer of President Obama. But even he bothered me somewhat with his tone in going after Trump on a couple occasions. It came off as snarkey and disrespectful. Calling things out seriously and in measured tone would have been a better course. I think Michelle nailed it, on the other hand.
 
map%20of%20us%2050%20percent%20.png


Using Census data, we've figured out that half of the United States population is clustered in just the 146 biggest counties out of over 3000.
http://www.businessinsider.com/half-of-the-united-states-lives-in-these-counties-2013-9

Notice the similarities and I think that puts your image into better perspective
I've lived in a lot of those counties. I'm surprised Hidalgo county, TX made that list. I guess McAllen has grown a lot since the last time I was there. :shrug:
 
See that tiny little spot in the south central portion of Idaho? That is where I live. It has typically reliably blue. It is starting to get a bit more purple. Unfortunately. Someday after the kids are out of school, we may end up moving back to Cascadia. Moving to a swing state to try and help is not a life choice option that I can consider.
 
See that tiny little spot in the south central portion of Idaho? That is where I live. It has typically reliably blue. It is starting to get a bit more purple. Unfortunately. Someday after the kids are out of school, we may end up moving back to Cascadia. Moving to a swing state to try and help is not a life choice option that I can consider.
 
Maybe it's time for the left to face up to something...

This mess is your fault.

The hatred you keep charging the other side with is the same hatred you feel for them. You look down on the right as intellectually inferior and treat them with condescension , insults and self righteous indignation.

The left and right are no more than 2 sides of the same corrupt coin.

What did you expect? You are not going to sway opinion to your side by being condescending and insulting. You tell them their values are no longer valid. You tell them they have to change.

You insult their families and call them deplorable.

Then you get indignant when they don't do what you tell them to do.

They didn't vote for Donald Trump because they're like him, they voted for the guy...

Who didn't tell them their way of life is invalid.

Who didn't tell them the things they value...patriotism, individual rights, family...are passe' and old fashioned..

Who didn't tell them they need to feel guilty for things that happened before they were born.

Who didn't tell them they need to apologize for being born American.

Did the left actually say all that? No, but that's what they heard through all of your insults and condescencion...

If the left wants to fix things, if they want to enact real, sweeping, permanent change they need to start with themselves...

Find a way to change minds without insults and condescension ...

Be better, get better, do better...

I'm going to preface this with "I like you jello, and you know that. I'm not mad at you. I'm mad at the view you put forth in the above quoted post. So with that disclaimer...


False.

Rubio, Bush, Carson, Cruz, et. all didn't tell them their way of life was invalid. They didn't tell them their way of life was old fashioned. They didn't make them feel guilty for things that happened before they were born. etc.

But THEY still didn't get the nod. Who got the nod for the GOP? The guy who made fun of disabled people. The guy who talks about women sometimes as if their appearance were the only thing that matters, but then other times tries to say he's the most feminist guy you'll ever meet. The guy who was a major figure in the birther movement. The guy who promised to ban people from entering our SECULAR country based on their RELIGION with goes DIRECTLY against our CONSTITUTION.

And as you said, did the left actually say all those things? No. (Which, are you actually excusing them for believing the right wing media's spin? And calling the left "condescending" for pointing that out?) But did Donald Trump actually say/do all those things I mention above? Yes. It's not a matter of interpretation. It's a matter of playing back fucking video evidence.

So don't tell me it's the left's fault for being too condescending when a young black kid gets shot in a park for playing with a toy gun, from a cop who practically jumps out of his car with the gun ready to fire, no warnings, no trying to talk to the kid, just open fire, and the left tries to say "See? This is exactly what we're talking about. There's a problem here that needs addressing." And the right answers back "Cops have a hard job." ...and that's the reasonable ones!!!

Don't try to tell me it's the left's fault for being too condescending when so many of my own friends and family are posting BLATANT lies on facebook, obviously not fact checking or looking into it, just saying "haha that supports my already held beliefs and I find it funny so I'm going to share it, whether it's true or not, because I don't value truth as much as I do being "right" and poking fun at the other side, and the do it so much and so often that it's impossible to address each one. And when you try to show them how the meme is false, or doesn't fairly show the intricacies of the actual issue at hand all you get in return is "[choose your source] is just part of the lame stream biased media." ...and that's the reasonable ones!!! You'll also get "Get a job and move out of your mom's basement, why don't you?!" Seriously, post ANYTHING remotely liberal on any topic in an open forum and someone will tell you to get a job and move out of your mom's basement, based on no other information than your stance on a social topic. Now, which side are you trying to tell me is FUCKING CONDESCENDING?! You ever been called a "Sheeple". Yeah, that's not FUCKING CONDESCENDING.

How many memes have you guys seen in the past two days about cops appeasing Trump protestors by handing out "Participation Trophies". Yeah...that's not FUCKING CONDESCENDING.

Don't try to play the left off as the side of condescension and "I'm better than you" attitude. You've obviously never taken the liberal side in an argument with the ilk of Trump supporters that I encounter online, and at work, and at my local bar. Everybody who supported Hillary is just "soooo fucking stupid and brainwashed and gullible."

If I'm condescending by telling someone they're ignorant for not knowing the facts of an issue that can be easily researched and proven, but instead they choose to use only Fox News and Brietbart and other non-recognizable no-name blog/news sources with 'conservanation-trunews-patriotpartynewsnation-realtruthparty' in the url....well theN I'll gladly take that label.

If someone believes that vaccines cause autism, or the earth is flat, or evolution isn't "real", ...isn't there some amount of condescension that's acceptable? I mean, how can you someone that everything they believe about a subject like that is just completely and utterly wrong without sounding at least somewhat condescending?! It's a similar problem when trying to tell someone that we, believe it or not, actually do have a problem with the police in this country, and whether it's racially motivated, or a systemic issue with requirement and training and policies, or some combination of the two, it does exist. You can't possibly watch every controversial police encounter video of the past 5-10 years (and there are LOTS of them) and after your finished come to the conclusion that nothing's wrong, and everything is working as it's supposed to without some fucking cognitive dissonant magic. Every case has it's nuances. Every case could and should be looked into closely. Not every one of them will result in the cop being guilty, nor should they. But you can't possibly take the sum total of them all and come to the conclusion that "Yup, everything is great." Yet... people hold that opinion. (mostly likely they've never bothered to actually WATCH all the videos, but... I can't bring that up because I'll sound condescending. They're allowed to base their opinion on their values, right. And if they value police officers because they stop bad guys, then they're allowed to believe that the police can do no wrong as a matter of definition. Right? And not letting them believe that is condescending and judgemental. Right?)

Come off it. This is a bullshit stance.
 
...[the left] are not willing to consider things from another point of view...

[the christians] say "hate the sin, love the sinner"...but the left hates the sins AND the sinners...

Really?!

...right here I was going to post a bunch of links and pictures to sites and news stories about gay marriage, gay "reform", blaming gays for things like hurricanes, transgender issues, bathrooms, abortion, climate change, fucking science, evolution, Ten Commandments in public places, churches not paying taxes but acting in a political fashion, ... but I don't think there's a need. You get the point.

Yeah, the right really takes a lot of time to consider the other point of view. [/sarcasm]

By pointing out the "sins" of the left, but completely ignoring the right's own guilt in the very same arena, you're coming off as supporting the right. Like Chad was saying.
 
Last edited:
Oh, I forgot religious hypocrites who only care about criminalizing abortion, so they'll vote for anyone, regardless of how monstrous, who they think will get Roe v Wade repealed.

That has always been my rub with the whole Pro-Life vs Pro-Choice battle.


Being Pro-Choice does not make you Pro-Abortion.... but when the Pro-Life people use their platform to attack Planned Parenthood, birth control, sex education and so forth it sure seems like they're Pro-Birth but forget about everything after the kid is born, and I can't rally around those elements that are always bundled into the argument.

Plus the fact that people rarely give two shits less about pro-life vs pro-choice except for election season. It's just a red vs blue tag line or an us vs them bullet point. :facepalm:
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top