OMG Politics, I'm over it already.

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Johnny N. said:
Spare me the false equivalency BS. Once it's false it's false and if someone is knowingly using false or misleading information to make their point it doesn't really matter how far along the curve they are. Bottom line question is, we are where we are and continuing to move the curve farther in any direction is not the solution.
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What "false equivalency"?

What I'm saying is that when you have conservatives claiming extreme bullshit like that Clinton ran a child sex ring out of a DC pizza parlor, it moves the right hand pole so far to the right, that when you say that Clinton's email server was not illegal, people just consider that liberal BS when in reality, it is the truth.
 
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335clone said:
I'm all for free speech, but whomever decided it would be a good idea to bring that little shit stirrer to Berkeley either didn't have a clue what they were doing, or knew EXACTLY what they were doing.
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This, right here is what I've been thinking all day.

The latter part. Look how well it's working on social media, HuffPost had a wave of trolls like I've never seen there. They've always had some, but note it's like they're outnumbering. I suspect it's organised somehow. (tin hat mode, I know)
 
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Lerxst said:
I don't agree that the destructive actions of a minority of protesters is what defines all of the protesters in attendance or justifies an idea of hate/stupidity tit-for-tat; no one here is advocating that any of the violent or destructive acts that were committed are OK or tolerable or condoned because Milo spews his brand of propaganda.
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First, I'm not being argumentative. I think we respect each other and can have these conversations.

So you are getting closer to what I think I'm seeing. Just like it should be common sense that the actions of a few don't represent the entire group, we probably shouldn't be lumping all liberals or all conservatives in the same separate piles but that is what is happening. I think it is the main thing driving the wedge between people.



OGG said:
The solution is to for the Supreme Court to rule the election invalid and to schedule a special election to undo this madness as quickly as possible. Of course that won't happen, but it's what should be done.

With all of the information that's coming to light, it's quite clear that this electoral process was tainted and illegitimate. The system failed on a grand scale.

We have a situation that is untenable and will only get worse.
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Assuming it is truly invalid, sure. I could go with that. But I'd say we would need to start with a whole new group. Wasn't it pretty much proven that the DNC hosed Bernie?


Chad said:
I would never vote for a Democrat that was hell bent on overturning Roe V Wade or opposed gay marriage. It is also why my doors would be open. I think if we forced everyone into a red state or blue state, we would see the red states start to shrink and shrink because I don't think most people want to deny folks rights and once they saw that world, they wouldn't want to be in it. But maybe that is the liberal in me, thinking that deep down, everyone is good and deserves a chance.
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The political part is what sucks. I would be willing to bet that the overwhelming majority of registered Republican or otherwise conservative voters don't have an issue with gay marriage or abortion but the Republican party holds the line on those. I think they still get votes based on other core philosophies with the assumption that they aren't going to do anything about those hot button issues anyway. That is my issue with the primarily 2 party situation. I wish I was smart enough to fix it.

As far as open doors, I'd also say that most of Americans don't mind open doors but many are concerned about open doors with no door man. So to speak. Taking a minute to make sure we have proper systems in place sounds like a decent idea and it's been done many times in the past. It's like the door on my house. I'll welcome most anyone who knocks but I still need the door because some folks would come in and take my stuff. Maybe the system that was in place was good enough and this is mostly a political stage but the concept of security at borders is solid and all of the recent Presidents have all shared that concern.
 
let's erase some of that separation between church and state on a contorted free speech argument

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/02/02/us/politics/johnson-amendment-trump.html

Under the provision, which was made in 1954, tax-exempt entities like churches and charitable organizations are unable to directly or indirectly participate in any political campaign on behalf of, or in opposition to, any candidate. Specifically, ministers are restricted from endorsing or opposing candidates from the pulpit. If they do, they risk losing their tax-exempt status.
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Ironically he quotes Jefferson, who was instrumental in the separation of church and state ideals that our country is founded on


I think this is apt:
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Help!I'maRock! said:
Because that wasn't true and everyone knew it.
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Maybe, maybe not. I frequent some forums where most of the members hold very conservative views & I can't tell you how many times I've seen this and comments that he is a filthy muslim hellbent on bringing sharia law to the USofA brought up in nearly every political thread during his administration.
 
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Chad said:
Why not, we just had 8 years of a Kenyan born president.
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Even if that were true (and it isn't), Obama would still be "a natural born citizen" by virtue of having an American citizen as a mother. While the laws on citizenship by way of a parent's citizenship have changed over the years, in general, if your mother was born a citizen, you are a citizen.
 
Johnny N. said:
I wasn't aware of that. Yeah, I suspect if more people were made aware of what alternative parties had to offer it would be a step in the right direction. I don't have a lot of confidence it will get legs either but if we ever needed it, this is the time.
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I just saw it today from @Aahzz FB. It's something to monitor. But I'm not speculating on it in the meantime.
 
Johnny N. said:
The political part is what sucks. I would be willing to bet that the overwhelming majority of registered Republican or otherwise conservative voters don't have an issue with gay marriage or abortion but the Republican party holds the line on those. I think they still get votes based on other core philosophies with the assumption that they aren't going to do anything about those hot button issues anyway. That is my issue with the primarily 2 party situation. I wish I was smart enough to fix it.

As far as open doors, I'd also say that most of Americans don't mind open doors but many are concerned about open doors with no door man. So to speak. Taking a minute to make sure we have proper systems in place sounds like a decent idea and it's been done many times in the past. It's like the door on my house. I'll welcome most anyone who knocks but I still need the door because some folks would come in and take my stuff. Maybe the system that was in place was good enough and this is mostly a political stage but the concept of security at borders is solid and all of the recent Presidents have all shared that concern.
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So what are those other core philosophies?

BTW, according to the latest Pew study, 62% of republicans are against abortion in most cases and 63% of republicans are against the supreme court decision to legalize gay marriage.

We have a doorman, it is the the immigration system. More people are killed each year by natural born Americans with guns than immigrants legally here or illegally here. Have we even had a discussion on gun violence? nope, just thoughts and prayer to the victims and families. How about we address real problems instead of using fear tactics to make up ones that aren't there.
 
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GomezAddams said:
Even if that were true (and it isn't), Obama would still be "a natural born citizen" by virtue of having an American citizen as a mother. While the laws on citizenship by way of a parent's citizenship have changed over the years, in general, if your mother was born a citizen, you are a citizen.
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I know, it was a zing. And that was the thing that cracked me up about the whole birther movement. Even if he was born on Mars, his mom was a citizen, so is he so the birth certificate made zero difference.
 
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