OMG Politics, I'm over it already.

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Lerxst said:
The criticism centers around foreign policy via twitter & not the content of his team's offical statement. The statement your referring to came two hours after his "Fidel Castro is dead!" tweet.


I get the inconsistencies in reactions to various events; that's the nature of the beast when you're exposed to many different opinions and beliefs on a given subject, especially the most polarizing reactions that get all the attention. Cherry picking reactions, thoughts, and beliefs & assigning them to this collective "we" is just a hodgepodge of strawmen and false equivalencies.
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I completely agree with the Twitter part and I was responding to the reference to the later statement that was shortened for affect I assume. And although this false equivalencies seems to be a cool new buzz phrase, my use of "we" is used only to show that I don't claim that I have all the right answers or that my beliefs are superior and clearly the only correct beliefs. All of us are guilty of letting our bias show when discussing beliefs. Whether we are equally guilty is irrelevant. so I use "we".
 
Johnny N. said:
If they are not of that opinion, they have never lived there or don't have family who have. I am married to a Cuban and my Cuban born family is bigger than my US born family these days and I'm in Southeast Florida so I have a fair amount of exposure to Cubans. I haven't heard of a single person who would have anything nicer to say than evil dictator. And the streets of Miami were full all day of people who celebrated the event. I don't know that I can agree with celebrating anyone's death but I can certainly understand why they would. And I can imagine there are Cubans who don't care one way or another but I can't imagine anyone thinking positively about him or his reign. And as much as we tend to villainize anyone who hurts someone else's feelings, I can't imagine why anyone would defend a guy like that. Not trying to pick a fight or saying anyone here supports Castro. Just funny that people hate Trump enough to dismiss the atrocities committed by Fidel.
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If you ignore the fact that the current administration is attempting to lead Cuba into a period of political and social reform through normalized relations, I could see expecting a condemnation of Castro from the White House as opposed to a tactful statement that attempts to acknowledge the reality of the situation but not inflame relations. Does that equal dismissing Castro's actions? I don't see it that way.
 
BlockInlay said:
It is 100% classless because he's the fucking president elect and he can barely behave like an adult, much less keep his yap shut until he actually thinks about what he's going to say.
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I'm with you on the original tweet. The later statement you referenced was actually just honest.
 
Lerxst said:
If you ignore the fact that the current administration is attempting to lead Cuba into a period of political and social reform through normalized relations, I could see expecting a condemnation of Castro from the White House as opposed to a tactful statement that attempts to acknowledge the reality of the situation but not inflame relations. Does that equal dismissing Castro's actions? I don't see it that way.
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What you are saying makes perfect sense but my perspective is a bit different because of my family situation. What appears on it's face to be political and social reform is probably more accurately financial reform between two governments. Basically avenues have opened or are opening for Americans to more easily visit. The logic being the influx of revenue is good for the Cuban people. But Europeans have been vacationing there for years at some of the nicest resorts I've seen yet nothing ever changed for the people. So I'm not so sure social reform is accurate. Either way, I don't really have an issue with a diplomatically neutral White House response but I don't really have a problem with an honest response either. Again, it is partly a perspective thing. Many people in my life have been affected personally and continue to be affected so I am more skeptical of the optimistic description of relations.

So do I think the White House was dismissing Castro's actions? No, but as you can imagine, there are a lot of people who may see it that way. And is Trump an ass? Sure, but my original point is that taking any opportunity to point it out ignoring the fact that he was talking about someone who killed, tortured, imprisoned, and oppressed the citizens of Cuba is kind of petty.

I appreciate your discussions.
 
Yeah, I get the feeling the Castro is Dead tweet is total Trump. The expanded and more somber statement is the clean-up crew trying to help create the illusion of Presidential and diplomatic temperament that Trump instinctively lacks.

Guys a douche, so the first things that come to his mind (and therefore out of his mouth) are douchey. Fidel was bad, but Trump has never cared UNLESS he felt that business opportunities were missed. Human rights violations are a non-issue for the man. Still a terrible choice on every level.
 
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Johnny N. said:
... Just funny that people hate Trump enough to dismiss the atrocities committed by Fidel.
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Whoa...

Please don't fall prey to the the popular Trump supporter tactic of associating criticism of Trump with hatred of Trump. We aren't criticizing Trump's message on Castro because it came from Trump, we are criticising the use of a negative message at a point of time when negativity will do no good.

No one is dismissing anything. Our government has finally reached the point where we realize the path we've taken with Cuba over the last 50 years has had zero impact on the Castro government, and has put a tremendous hardship on the Cuban people. It is time to move forward. Making antagonistic remarks about Fidel Castro isn't going to help a single thing. But it will sour our relationship with Raul.
 
@GomezAddams i aggree.

i wouldn't dismiss any of the atrocities that Fidel has committed or were committed by others on his orders.

but what trump said and the way he said it is unpresidential, undiplomatic and frankly unacceptable as the prime representative of the US people to the rest of the world. it's not just impolite to the cubans or the cuban government, it sends a bad message to ALL of the countries we deal with and paints a terrible picture of the US citizens. (since we elected the jerk)
 
Learning new words like "kleptocracy" and "kakistocracy" regarding the forthcoming Trump Administration, and realizing we've lived under both of these realities for my entire life. The least qualified and unprincipled thieves with the worst intentions, governing for their own gain, at the expense of the people.
 
GomezAddams said:
Whoa...

Please don't fall prey to the the popular Trump supporter tactic of associating criticism of Trump with hatred of Trump. We aren't criticizing Trump's message on Castro because it came from Trump, we are criticising the use of a negative message at a point of time when negativity will do no good.

No one is dismissing anything. Our government has finally reached the point where we realize the path we've taken with Cuba over the last 50 years has had zero impact on the Castro government, and has put a tremendous hardship on the Cuban people. It is time to move forward. Making antagonistic remarks about Fidel Castro isn't going to help a single thing. But it will sour our relationship with Raul.
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I despise Trump, but can directly point to endless actual things he has done and said to justify my disgust with him as a person. He's his own attack dog with no one to rein him in. His base instincts drive just about every decision he makes. He has no legal expertise or record of public service in any way, shape, or form. We nkow from the tweeting and his speeches how he really thinks, feels, and judges. His perception of th world is completely transparent and lacking in understanding and depth. And to top all of that shit off, he's surrounding himself (in part) with people that are so horrible they almost make him not seem so bad...but w mustn't forget that he's crap.

Here's a ballparker of a take on Trump and the situation that we are all now a party to:

 
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