Achtung! Who else doesn't like
- Thread starter wok
- Start date
vonbladet
r00b
Here in the Netherlands, the local children get their presents from Sinterklaas (no relation, hem hem) and irritate my son by claiming that Santa Claus (who gives them nothing) couldn't possibly be real because flying reindeer. Our household orthodoxy is that the two (clearly entirely unrelated) white-bearded-and-red-robed benefactors have exclusive rights in their respective territories and by the way Sinterklaas has a horse that can reach every roof in the Netherlands in the course of a single night so maybe let's keep the sunlight off of ALL of the magics, OK?
(We sail for Eng-ger-lnd on Friday night.)
(We sail for Eng-ger-lnd on Friday night.)
wok
Unholy Meat Obelisk
ah, my bad:
"Thirty-nine local authorities in the UK either imposed an outright ban, or imposed an X (18 years) certificate, effectively preventing the film from being shown, as the distributors said it could not be shown unless it was unedited and carried the original AA (14) certificate. Some countries, including Ireland and Norway, banned its showing, with a few of these bans lasting decades."
wok
Unholy Meat Obelisk
Me being a Dutchman in the UK, have to tell my daughter Sinterklaas/St Nicolaas and Santa Claus are the same person, just visiting different countries on different dates. She's lucky, because she gets presents on 2 occasions
vonbladet
r00b
I bow to your Backstory Reconciliation Engine! My children are very picky about The Lore which clearly states that Sinterklaas lives in Espain and comes by boat (with a horse and some Controversial Helpers), while Santa lives at the North Pole and has flying reindeer and a staff of Uncontroversial Elves.
Anyway, Santa only brings minor presents; the real Christmas presents are from named individuals, and there are (thankfully) no Piss-Poor Pomes to go with them.
Abrasion
Nonplussed
Aw, I do actually miss the parade of controversial helpers a bit. Only remember it vaguely as I moved to England when I was but a toddler
Acadiafall
Kiss Me Hardy
Ive been there for whatever the thing is where they black their faces up. It was brilliant.
I read about some party poopers last year in Amsterdam trying to get it banned. Bloody pc killjoys.
I read about some party poopers last year in Amsterdam trying to get it banned. Bloody pc killjoys.
vonbladet
r00b
This year there has been more pushback, and pushback against the pushback, but the people who make the Sinterklaasjournaal (a daily programme watched by essentially all the children) came up with ways to adjust the mythos to contemporary tastes while staying true to its spirit. Not everyone was pleased, and it remains to be seen if it sticks, but I liked it.
wok
Unholy Meat Obelisk
yesw, because protesting outdated quasi-racist stereotypes from colonial times is being a 'pc killjoy'.
FYI, in an effort to make it acceptable for all, one mayor proposed to instead use 'rainbow' Petes. He received death threats
Acadiafall
Kiss Me Hardy
yesw, because protesting outdated quasi-racist stereotypes from colonial times is being a 'pc killjoy'.
FYI, in an effort to make it acceptable for all, one mayor proposed to instead use 'rainbow' Petes. He received death threats
As far as I remember it, it was a lot of kids having a good time. There was nothing 'racist' about it. So wind your neck in.
Plus apparently the vast majority of your countrymen don't think its racist either, according to the news. No need to get your knickers in a twist.
wok
Unholy Meat Obelisk
The whole origin of Zwarte Piet in itself is racist, not saying there is any racist intent in the celebrations. A tradition is not in itself a reason it is always acceptable.
And what most people think is not necessarily a good indication of facts.
Abrasion
Nonplussed
I was under the impression that Zwarte Piet – much like similar traditions in Europe and older ones in Britain – represented miners, rather than 'natives'.The whole origin of Zwarte Piet in itself is racist, not saying there is any racist intent in the celebrations. A tradition is not in itself a reason it is always acceptable.
And what most people think is not necessarily a good indication of facts.
Happy to be corrected in this though
vonbladet
r00b
It is sometimes claimed that they got so black from coming down all of the chimneys. This is transparently a retcon, but I am otherwise fine with it. This year's TV version, they actually showed the process as a bunch of new recruits were trained, and there were also ome white-face clown Pieten and in the big reveal at the finale, the retired Piet who'd come back to help run the show was promoted to be a Sinterklaas in his own right.
It has been a politically contentious issue; it is being addressed; the deliberately long and deliberately low-key discussions with interest groups are going on behind the scenes, and it is all a rather touching advert for the Dutch "polder model" of laboriously consensual politics.
You can still get plenty of indignance from people of assorted views, and it has dominated a lot of recent conversations; I look forward to a future where it doesn't.
In traditional Dutch holiday tradition they are supposed to represent Spanish Moors, where Sinterklaas was thought to come from. My parents told me all these stories when I was a kid (they are Dutch).
Johnny N.
Kick Henry Jackassowski
What a miserable lot. Or maybe it has just become the "in" thing to hate and oppose everything.
So what if it is commercial? So what if some celebrate from a religious base? The cool thing about this country is you can participate to whatever level you want, or not at all. And if you choose to not participate, it doesnt mean no one else can or they are naive or offensive if they believe or celebrate differently than you.
I love Christmas and everything that comes with it. Well, except for the traffic. That can be pretty annoying so I tend to stay out of it. Life can get too busy. Using a holiday as a reminder to slow down and spend time with friends and family is good for the soul. Holidays can be great times to be purposefully positive and we can all stand to be a little more positive.
Whatever holiday you celebrate and to whatever level you choose, have a happy one.
So what if it is commercial? So what if some celebrate from a religious base? The cool thing about this country is you can participate to whatever level you want, or not at all. And if you choose to not participate, it doesnt mean no one else can or they are naive or offensive if they believe or celebrate differently than you.
I love Christmas and everything that comes with it. Well, except for the traffic. That can be pretty annoying so I tend to stay out of it. Life can get too busy. Using a holiday as a reminder to slow down and spend time with friends and family is good for the soul. Holidays can be great times to be purposefully positive and we can all stand to be a little more positive.
Whatever holiday you celebrate and to whatever level you choose, have a happy one.
Gary Blanchard
beloved, local musician
Feeling bad about the holidays? How about some holiday cheer?
Ho, ho, ho!
Ho, ho, ho!