OMG Politics, I'm over it already.

Status
Not open for further replies.
OGG said:
Why are you sorry?

Nobody "needs" a Supercar. They exist because their is a market for them. Most of them are never daily drivers. The vast majority of them rarely get driven at all. A Supercar is no different than a 200W Marshall... no one needs it, lots of people want it.

In my case, the closest two cars I ever had to "Supercar" status were my Porsche 930S and my GT-R. When I had the Porsche, I drove a Honda every day that was cheap and efficient. With the GT-R, it spent 99.9% of its time in the garage. Meanwhile, I'm out driving around in a FIAT that gets ludicrously good mileage and was barely $16K brand new, fully loaded after all of the sales and rebates.

I don't disagree with you at all, but it's the Mustang GT 500 Shelby Cobra Mach 1 VST blah blah and the Corvettes that are the bigger "issue". These things are attainable and cheap. They are everywhere all the time. Millions of them. Nobody needs one of those either, yet they are hugely popular daily drivers that suck down gas like crazy.

That seems much crazier to me.
Click to expand...
sorry.....i was lumping everything with 400 Hp+ into the supercar bucket. i know they are hugely popular. i used to have one of the fastest factory muscle cars made, but that was in the 70's. now i have a 4 cyl jeep patriot (which i hate, but not because it's a 4 banger....because it's got fucked up censors that keep coding out).
i was trying to point out that we USED to be going in a smaller more efficient direction.....and now it's bigger, faster......yadda yadda.
look at the damn trend of giant pickups with big HP motors. wtf? are they really going to pull a 5th wheel with them? NO. are they really going to have traverse foot deep mud with them? HELL NO. so why do they need something that gets 12 MPG with today's technology?
that was my point.
it's not about there's a market for them. or about 'if you have the money, you should be able to buy anything you want'. i disagree. i want a fucking M-60, but (for practical purposes) i'm not allowed to have one. the giant trucks and the 500 HP cars are just irresponsible, knowing what we know now and how much those kinds of machines are contributing to the problem.

i'll stop now.
 
shoeless said:
Yeah, but then you have to pay the software developers to get the answers you want out of all those sensors. :)
Click to expand...
as i said in another post here......i have a car with all the sensors, and i would rather have a VW Beetle, except for the 4wd, which is kinda needed around here.
the damn thing is always throwing codes. fuck those computers. :mad:
 
OGG said:
Why are you sorry?

I don't disagree with you at all, but it's the Mustang GT 500 Shelby Cobra Mach 1 VST blah blah and the Corvettes that are the bigger "issue". These things are attainable and cheap. They are everywhere all the time. Millions of them. Nobody needs one of those either, yet they are hugely popular daily drivers that suck down gas like crazy.

That seems much crazier to me.
Click to expand...
That, and Suburbans, Tahoes, Expeditions, Escalades, Navigators, Sierras, Armadas, etc. being used as grocery getters. If you are pulling something with it, like a boat or trailer, or off road (though the 20+inch wheels on some of those tends to rule that out), then fine. But get the groceries in a little honda, suby, VW, Mazda, Chevy Volt, Ford C-max, Prius, etc. please. It is one of the big reasons I keep calling out for the return of the little sportwagon. I would really love Musk to have his more affordable model in a wagon, or if aerodynamics don't allow it, hatchback with good storage, model. Enough storage for amps, skis, bikes laid down with the seats down, etc.
 
sunvalleylaw said:
That, and Suburbans, Tahoes, Expeditions, Escalades, Navigators, Sierras, Armadas, etc. being used as grocery getters. If you are pulling something with it, like a boat or trailer, or off road (though the 20+inch wheels on some of those tends to rule that out), then fine. But get the groceries in a little honda, suby, VW, Mazda, Chevy Volt, Ford C-max, Prius, etc. please. It is one of the big reasons I keep calling out for the return of the little sportwagon. I would really love Musk to have his more affordable model in a wagon, or if aerodynamics don't allow it, hatchback with good storage, model. Enough storage for amps, skis, bikes laid down with the seats down, etc.
Click to expand...
That, and driving economical vehicles just makes good, old conservative fiscal sense, on a personal level.
 
mongooz said:
sorry.....i was lumping everything with 400 Hp+ into the supercar bucket. i know they are hugely popular. i used to have one of the fastest factory muscle cars made, but that was in the 70's. now i have a 4 cyl jeep patriot (which i hate, but not because it's a 4 banger....because it's got fucked up censors that keep coding out).
i was trying to point out that we USED to be going in a smaller more efficient direction.....and now it's bigger, faster......yadda yadda.
look at the damn trend of giant pickups with big HP motors. wtf? are they really going to pull a 5th wheel with them? NO. are they really going to have traverse foot deep mud with them? HELL NO. so why do they need something that gets 12 MPG with today's technology?
that was my point.
it's not about there's a market for them. or about 'if you have the money, you should be able to buy anything you want'. i disagree. i want a fucking M-60, but (for practical purposes) i'm not allowed to have one. the giant trucks and the 500 HP cars are just irresponsible, knowing what we know now and how much those kinds of machines are contributing to the problem.

i'll stop now.
Click to expand...
I've been in the auto business since 1989 and agree completely with you...I think it's irresponsible of the manufacturers to continue to market in the manner they do...there is a practical need for the heavier trucks but it's not for basic transportation...stop making luxury 1 ton trucks and people will stop thinking they need one...

On a related note, it has been my experience that the latest generations of engine control computers has been much more reliable than those from the 80s and 90s, and have gone a long way toward reducing emmisions and increasing efficiency...but they are also notoriously harder to diagnose and repair when things do go wrong...
 
jelloman said:
.but they are also notoriously harder to diagnose and repair when things do go wrong...
Click to expand...
especially when the stupid fucking engineers decide to locate the crank sensor BEHIND and protrusion on the transmission, requiring the tranny to be REMOVED to replace the sensor :mad::mad::mad:
 
We really do haul a boat over a 8700 foot pass and camp way out rutted dirt roads and drive washboardy roads to trail heads, etc. and others do even more, hunting and etc. the right tool for the right job I say.

But I also think in 10 years Musk may improve batteries to the point where that can be done with an electric rig. They already have the power, and he has a rig that can pull a boat on the paved anyway. Plenty of torque in those electric motors. Just a matter of time. Seems to me a company would want to invest in the future rather than squeeze the last drops out of the dead dinos.
 
sunvalleylaw said:
We really do haul a boat over a 8700 foot pass and camp way out rutted dirt roads and drive washboardy roads to trail heads, etc. and others do even more, hunting and etc. the right tool for the right job I say.

But I also think in 10 years Musk may improve batteries to the point where that can be done with an electric rig. They already have the power, and he has a rig that can pull a boat on the paved anyway. Plenty of torque in those electric motors. Just a matter of time. Seems to me a company would want to invest in the future rather than squeeze the last drops out of the dead dinos.
Click to expand...

oh yea.......DC motors have spectacular power, using the right gearing. but as you say.....they suck voltage and that takes major battery capacity. need a flux capacitor.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top