I’m crazy. I purchased a fretless Vigier Excalibur

Flamencology said:
Yup. Trombones too.

And beside orchestral music... pretty much any much any bluegrass ensemble that has a dobro.
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And honestly, as a newly minted jazz band director (and former trumpet player) I'm also dealing with the fact that even wind instruments with set pitch selection like trumpet or sax also require proper technique and a conscious ear to play in tune, especially in regards to section work.
 
Now I have worked with it for an hour or two. I bought a tiny half-round d’adaddario set, and put them on. Ugh, horrible dead strings, they stayed for 3 minutes. I put on my ordinary Ernie Ball custom 9-38 set and they sounded great, but the B and E-string didn’t sing. Guess I need to put them higher, but have my keys at home. The pickups are also very low, compered to what I got used to in the early -70s. The winning formula then was thin strings, low action, high pickups, heavy amps and high volume. I’ve never find a reason to question that.
 
that's a cool guitar. everyone seems pretty positive about it, me included, but I wouldn't know the first thing. I hope you enjoy it.
 
I came home and picked out all keys I have for guitar work. The problem was that the thin e and b strings didn’t ring out well over the 12th fret. So I fixed a higher action on the 3 thinner strings. It became better, but not perfect. Then I started to play with a small amp, and suddenly I realize why it doesn’t work. A fretless guitar and bass has no frets (!!!), so your finger becomes the ”fret”. But it’s not metal, it’s soft tissue that lies over the string. A fretless bassplayer I know says he has the same problem on the g-string played high up on the neck. The string can not vibrate so much. For a guitar it becomes even worse, put your fat fleshy fingers on a thin string high up on the neck and it does not vibrate. One solution is to use slightly thicker strings. Another one; when you go over the 12th frets on the thin strings, put down your nails on the string and it sings better because it’s harder and more like a metal ”fret”. Tricky technique, but not impossible. Classical guitarists often use their nails.
 
WilmerTheWhite said:
I came home and picked out all keys I have for guitar work. The problem was that the thin e and b strings didn’t ring out well over the 12th fret. So I fixed a higher action on the 3 thinner strings. It became better, but not perfect. Then I started to play with a small amp, and suddenly I realize why it doesn’t work. A fretless guitar and bass has no frets (!!!), so your finger becomes the ”fret”. But it’s not metal, it’s soft tissue that lies over the string. A fretless bassplayer I know says he has the same problem on the g-string played high up on the neck. The string can not vibrate so much. For a guitar it becomes even worse, put your fat fleshy fingers on a thin string high up on the neck and it does not vibrate. One solution is to use slightly thicker strings. Another one; when you go over the 12th frets on the thin strings, put down your nails on the string and it sings better because it’s harder and more like a metal ”fret”. Tricky technique, but not impossible. Classical guitarists often use their nails.
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So you are saying Guthrie Govan is superhuman? :lol:
 
WilmerTheWhite said:
I came home and picked out all keys I have for guitar work. The problem was that the thin e and b strings didn’t ring out well over the 12th fret. So I fixed a higher action on the 3 thinner strings. It became better, but not perfect. Then I started to play with a small amp, and suddenly I realize why it doesn’t work. A fretless guitar and bass has no frets (!!!), so your finger becomes the ”fret”. But it’s not metal, it’s soft tissue that lies over the string. A fretless bassplayer I know says he has the same problem on the g-string played high up on the neck. The string can not vibrate so much. For a guitar it becomes even worse, put your fat fleshy fingers on a thin string high up on the neck and it does not vibrate. One solution is to use slightly thicker strings. Another one; when you go over the 12th frets on the thin strings, put down your nails on the string and it sings better because it’s harder and more like a metal ”fret”. Tricky technique, but not impossible. Classical guitarists often use their nails.
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Cellists and bassists use thumb position for — essentially a relatively loose barre with the thumb — to get around this issue.

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Thumb would be uncomfortable/impractical for a traditionally-held guitar. But a relaxed barre with the index finger would work fine.
 
WilmerTheWhite said:
I came home and picked out all keys I have for guitar work. The problem was that the thin e and b strings didn’t ring out well over the 12th fret. So I fixed a higher action on the 3 thinner strings. It became better, but not perfect. Then I started to play with a small amp, and suddenly I realize why it doesn’t work. A fretless guitar and bass has no frets (!!!), so your finger becomes the ”fret”. But it’s not metal, it’s soft tissue that lies over the string. A fretless bassplayer I know says he has the same problem on the g-string played high up on the neck. The string can not vibrate so much. For a guitar it becomes even worse, put your fat fleshy fingers on a thin string high up on the neck and it does not vibrate. One solution is to use slightly thicker strings. Another one; when you go over the 12th frets on the thin strings, put down your nails on the string and it sings better because it’s harder and more like a metal ”fret”. Tricky technique, but not impossible. Classical guitarists often use their nails.
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Thimbles?
 
Flamencology and Miguel discuss cellos and fretless basses, that have wood fretboards and quite fat strings. Interesting comments, but remember that the Vigier is a different animal, it has a metal fretboard and on the upper side thin plain strings - and there’s no bow that can be used to make the strings sing longer. So it’s more like a sarod. How do Indians play a sarod to make the thin strings ring out? Actually, they use their nails.
But the ”problem” with less sustain comes only on the e- and b-strings above where the 12th fret use to be. The rest of the fingerboard works fine, I put on the nails only if I need sustain on the e and b, high on the neck.

Edit: here’s an Indian guy explaining the technique for playing the sarod. On the thin strings the tone does not ring out, so he use glued on nails.
 
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So I got the Vigier back from my luthier, who had put in a new Switchcraft inputjack. So.. I attacked the fingerboard with autosol metal polish to get it very shiny. 5 minutes and it was like new. I then polished it with french calvados , since autosol taste bad on the fingers. Apple brandy is better. A new set of strings, that was also polished with calvados, since fretless tends to stain your fingers more. Ok, mission accomplished, everythings just perfect.
Problem is... have I gone too nerdy in the corona crisis? :(
Edit: turns out that calvados also tend to slightly stain the fingers. So I did a polish with Russkij Standart vodka instead, since it’s supposed to be very very clean. Ok, it was better but still some. I ended up using a cloth with ordinary water, and wiped it with a dry one. Mission completed.
 
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Very cool!!!! I would need to order one with fret lines, but would prob still struggle with it, but I’m always glad to see people embrace unique tools like this!
 
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