Youtube guitar cover song lessons

OGG said:
Wow! OP seens more than a bit harsh. How do you reconcile the fact that someone can "learn all the notes and bends", with the phrase "no musical talent"?
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it is just my pet peeve opinion that compared to the numbers of people pursuing classical music careers or hobbies, the numbers of people buying guitars to rock out exceeds the numbers of people in society with natural musical talent. Now they can be ambitious and spend large percentages of their waking lives learning and practicing, and will definitely reach certain levels of proficiency. But it's the only explanation for the large numbers of proficient "rock" guitarists who make completely uncompelling music. Classical music has more standards and people who don't make the cut get weeded out. The reason for the attraction to rock, is the rock star and rock lifestyle aspects that draw people that didn't pick up any toy they had in childhood and try to make music on it. Born musicians go around singing any songs they hear as children, try to figure out tunes on those kiddie xylophones before they can write or read, try to play tunes on broken rubber bands against their ear, and play drums on pot and pans until they can either afford or are given a real musical instrument. Rock guitarists take up guitar because they think it's cool and a great way to get girls. Just a theory I have and purely speculative opinion. I would probably change it if I saw more teenagers playing air (orchestra) conductor instead of air guitar (although you don't see the younger generation attracted to guitars as much nowadays).

Oh think I missed your point. Yes, I would expect to run into more videos by teachers that have natural musical ability. Mark Wein isn't available on youtube I don't think.
 
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bsman said:
I've learned a lot from youtube videos. Steve Stephens has an awesome one describing how to play Bill Idol's "Rebel Yell" that I've spent watched a bunch of times. I still have to pick my jaw up off the floor at times. Usually, I find that a minute or so is sufficient to determine if the video is worth watching or not.
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He is so fucking good....
 
dodgechargerfan said:
While I'll agree with what you say if you're going for an exact cover of a single recording, I'll say that you're wrong for calling me wrong.

It's music. Not even the original artists play it the same way every time.
Why do people keep going to see music performed live? Why is there more than one orchestra in the world if they're all playing the same pieces exactly the same as the original?

If you need music to be that perfect, fire up your sequencer and load in a saved program and hit go. Sell your guitars.
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Wrong again! Sequencers don't make perfect music. Perfection doesn't mean always consistent and monotonous. Nuanced with feel is what makes great players as I'm sure you agree. The discipline of learning is copying those nuances when you're learning someone else's tune or solo. Putting in your own feel is what you do when you make your own music or perform the cover you learned. But learn it first. Feel, touch, phrasing, picking dynamics, hammering or picking each note, are all elements of the music you're learning. Just learning the notes and the timing as you suggested and putting your whatever style on it is much closer to your sequencer analogy than learning the nuanced technique that I'm suggesting.

When you hear orchestras you're not hearing their learning process. You don't think every great pianist who plays Bach hasn't studied and copied Glen Gould? It's not what they're going to finally perform as they develop their own interpretations. But they also don't muddy their education of past pianists interpretations by ignoring it when that's exactly what they're learning. It's a much better example than rock, because the notes and meter are a given by Bach that never changes. You study past interpretations, cop them, then develop your own style and interpretation.

Just kidding about the "wrong" but it sounds dramatic.
 
rickenvox said:
Wrong again! Sequencers don't make perfect music. Perfection doesn't mean always consistent and monotonous. Nuanced with feel is what makes great players as I'm sure you agree. The discipline of learning is copying those nuances when you're learning someone else's tune or solo. Putting in your own feel is what you do when you make your own music or perform the cover you learned. But learn it first. Feel, touch, phrasing, picking dynamics, hammering or picking each note, are all elements of the music you're learning. Just learning the notes and the timing as you suggested and putting your whatever style on it is much closer to your sequencer analogy than learning the nuanced technique that I'm suggesting.

When you hear orchestras you're not hearing their learning process. You don't think every great pianist who plays Bach hasn't studied and copied Glen Gould? It's not what they're going to finally perform as they develop their own interpretations. But they also don't muddy their education of past pianists interpretations by ignoring it when that's exactly what they're learning. It's a much better example than rock, because the notes and meter are a given by Bach that never changes. You study past interpretations, cop them, then develop your own style and interpretation.

Just kidding about the "wrong" but it sounds dramatic.
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Gould is a bad example, I think. His sound and mind were so unmistakably his own that imitation is unwise. That's one single example where avoidance of imitation - not avoidance of listening - is probably to be encouraged.

But yeah, being a serious classical musician does develop and encourage listening skills in a way that rock music usually doesn't. When you have literally dozens of truly great recordings of a single piece to compare to, you start thinking a lot more about each and every detail. There's also the acceptance that, if you're not doing your homework as a scholar, then that will show in your playing. No point in trying to reinvent the wheel. Wheel reinvention has been prized and praised throughout rock music's relatively short life.
 
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Flamencology said:
Gould is a bad example, I think. His sound and mine were so unmistakably his own that imitation is unwise. That's one single example where avoidance of imitation - not avoidance of listening - is probably to be encouraged.

But yeah, being a serious classical musician does develop and encourage listening skills in a way that rock music usually doesn't. When you have literally dozens of truly great recordings of a single piece to compare to, you start thinking a lot more about each and every detail.
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Yes, probably a bad example. But I didn't really expect an actual classical music listener to chime in. :facepalm:
He's well known and had a documentary film made about him, I didn't want to cite someone even more obscure.

But learning rock properly should pay the same attention to detail, don't you think?
 
rickenvox said:
Yes, probably a bad example. But I didn't really expect an actual classical music listener to chime in. :facepalm:
He's well known and had a documentary film made about him, I didn't want to cite someone even more obscure.

But learning rock properly should pay the same attention to detail, don't you think?
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Not just a documentary film, but also a really great biopic starring Colm Feore; Thirty-Two Short Films About Glenn Gould.

I edited my post and fleshed it out a little.

But to that last question, yes and no. It's not really possible. You can't compare and contrast edited scores or (in many instances) even recordings when you're learning rock music. If that is an option, then I'd absolutely encourage it. I mean, amazingly, the best version of the 'Stairway to Heaven' solo is from The Song Remains the Same. And transcription is always worthwhile practice.
 
Why do a lesson from a youtube amateur when there are usually a couple of youtubes by the original artists to learn from?
 
rickenvox said:
Hotel California - please go ahead and post the best youtube instruction if you have one
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First off, I agree that actual artist video lessons are rare, but they are out there in some cases. As I said earlier, there are a few very good lesson site on youtube that I have found worthwhile.

here are a couple. The lessons range from easy to advanced so there is usually something interesting to find

https://www.youtube.com/user/JustinSandercoeSongs

https://www.youtube.com/user/martyzsongs

This guy doesn't give lessons per se but has clear angles so it's pretty easy to figure out what he's doing

https://www.youtube.com/user/privettricker


But......
Since you asked.......




























:rim:












 
335clone said:
First off, I agree that actual artist video lessons are rare, but they are out there in some cases. As I said earlier, there are a few very good lesson site on youtube that I have found worthwhile.

here are a couple. The lessons range from easy to advanced so there is usually something interesting to find

https://www.youtube.com/user/JustinSandercoeSongs

https://www.youtube.com/user/martyzsongs

This guy doesn't give lessons per se but has clear angles so it's pretty easy to figure out what he's doing

https://www.youtube.com/user/privettricker


But......
Since you asked.......




























:rim:












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Lols. 3 pages. It took 3 pages before somebody finally posted that Don Felder video. I almost did it in my first reply, but I was loving the delicious irony of a thread built around trying to learn this song by watching asshats on YouTube and complaining about how "different" they were. It gave me some serious chuckles. :)
 
rickenvox said:
Hotel California - please go ahead and post the best youtube instruction if you have one
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OK

From the masters themselves:

Hotel California at Capital Center 1977

No Bucks
Audacity
http://www.audacityteam.org/

Audacity Slowdown


Audacity Loop


Got Bucks
Transcribe! https://www.seventhstring.com/

I used Audacity for years. Youtube shows you how to use it. Transcribe! does it all and more but costs $.

Slowdown and Loop. You can learn anything and you do not have to put up with know-it-all attitude.
Go for it!
 
Music is a form of communication. Rick, it's as if you're criticizing people for poor grammar and vocabulary, and unoriginal usage in their speech. They still have every right to say what they want; you don't have to listen.

Frankly, I have no time to listen to those who a) ape others ... as if guitar solos are some incantatory religion?; and b) think that technical ability means you are more interesting to hear. That last one is usually a very, very sticky wicket on guitar forums.

On another forum in a galaxy far away, there is a cover band who post videos of their attempt to do 'near perfect' renditions of classic rock songs. They're fairly good, and IMO entirely unlistenable.

Cover bands have their place and time, but I try like hell to avoid them.
 
Danhedonia said:
Music is a form of communication. Rick, it's as if you're criticizing people for poor grammar and vocabulary, and unoriginal usage in their speech. They still have every right to say what they want; you don't have to listen.

Frankly, I have no time to listen to those who a) ape others ... as if guitar solos are some incantatory religion?; and b) think that technical ability means you are more interesting to hear. That last one is usually a very, very sticky wicket on guitar forums.

On another forum in a galaxy far away, there is a cover band who post videos of their attempt to do 'near perfect' renditions of classic rock songs. They're fairly good, and IMO entirely unlistenable.

Cover bands have their place and time, but I try like hell to avoid them.
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This thread has really grown way beyond my original frustration with finding a good youtube guitar breakdown of Hotel California (partially my fault). I have the ability to sit down and learn it from the record no problem, but additional time I didn't want to take since this is just a fun project.

Besides that, I'm only talking about teaching and/or learning covers of songs and their solos. I am not talking about the value of being a cover band or musician. I couldn't care less about that. And if I had a bone to pick with cover bands it's their singers and not guitar players. But, again don't care.

When I have been in bands I played mostly original music, in my own style. When I go out to hear live music, even at local dive bars, I only go to hear original material. In LA there's plenty of original local music that you could live your whole live without having to see a cover band in a bar.

When I go to youtube to learn a solo I want the guy to play it like the recording, I'm not going on youtube to learn the individual stylings of Joe Shmo and his unique interpretation of Hotel California. And once learned, I'm never going to see the youtube lesson again. Like tab it's just a time saving measure.

Not sure why this triggered any controversy whatsoever. I will spend seconds pondering that.
 
OGG said:
Lols. 3 pages. It took 3 pages before somebody finally posted that Don Felder video. I almost did it in my first reply, but I was loving the delicious irony of a thread built around trying to learn this song by watching asshats on YouTube and complaining about how "different" they were. It gave me some serious chuckles. :)
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The post was only an observation about the audacity of people posting lessons of solos they can't play properly on youtube, that's it. I had the solo figured out before I made the first post. Then all of the cover band guitarists started replying.
 
Great.

Now we can move on to the larger problems, which are that the fact that The Eagles existed and that people still want to play and/or hear their product.
 
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