Smashing guitars is dumb

[Peen Simmons]

Ethan Hein is a music professor at NYU.

He’s an adjunct working on his dissertation and it looks like he focuses on music education—specifically teaching hip-hop. I mean, got my MA in History and did my research through a cultural theory lens where I focused on counterculture (specifically rock culture) identity-formation specifically the intersections of age/whiteness/gender.

So we’re probably working from different angles. But I’m pretty confident in my argument that teenage art school millionaires in the 1960s living like debauched 17th century aristocrats were not the vanguard of the prole revolution.

 

[Bones McHorror]

Also, that Ethan guy is just flat out wrong to posit rock and/or roll as somehow anti-capitalist or involved in class struggle. It’s like he never read a book and totally missed the gag behind the Sex Pistols.

It's true. I think this is a weird fantasy. To believe that Phoebe is trying to make some political statement here, which is not really her personality at all.

But also the fantasy of believing that some underprivileged kid who apparently deserves her guitars more than her would do it. Like it's some cheesy 90s disney movie come to life. On top of that the guy doesn't even like guitar himself. "Here kid, here is the dorkiest thing ever besides harpsichord... have fun destroying capitalism for us."

An unrelated note: people are far more condescending to female musicians about this type of stuff. They assume they have never heard music or understand references to things. And need this stuff pointed out that Pete Townshend did the thing or whatever. And that guitars used to be cool and now they suck just in time for when your career rolled around coincidentally! Making his statement ostensibly about poor kids and some fantasy rebellion against capital kind of masks over that.

It's also bitchy to talk about another musician like this to your twitter followers. I mean if you were just making fun of Marilyn Manson right now, okay. But in this case it just comes across as bitchy and bad manners. He is trying to use his twitter clout to hurt her career in some way through canceling.

 

[Help!I'maRock!]

He’s an adjunct working on his dissertation and it looks like he focuses on music education—specifically teaching hip-hop. I mean, got my MA in History and did my research through a cultural theory lens where I focused on counterculture (specifically rock culture) identity-formation specifically the intersections of age/whiteness/gender.

So we’re probably working from different angles. But I’m pretty confident in my argument that teenage art school millionaires in the 1960s living like debauched 17th century aristocrats were not the vanguard of the prole revolution.

This is why I want you to debate him.

 

[Bones McHorror]

I honestly didn't put that much thought into it. Just trying to make a joke. Win some, lose some. In fact, he hasn't even come in on this thread.

In any case, I basically agree with Ethan. It is silly in this day and age.

I think I understand the gist...

 

[jp_nyc]

I have never been a fan of guitar smashing, but what are the chances that ya'll would be talking about her right now if she hadn't done that? And if enough people click in to watch her smash a guitar maybe some folks will also listen to her music and become fans. All part of the business, and like it or not, music is now a business,

Good point. If she hadn’t banged up that guitar I would know as much about her as I know about most SNL musical guests—nothing.

 

[DdBob]

If I were on SNL I would dig deep and refrence an anomoly....I would wear fly glasses and phone the White House with a landline

 

[Peen Simmons]

This is why I want you to debate him.

I’m not much of a debater. Academically, I’ve been much more of a “yelling fire in a crowded theater” type in terms of finding the weak points in an argument or the soft underbelly of a beloved assumption and then poking it in public. I love a good argument and my approach on panels or when post-presentation Q&A starts tends toward razzle dazzle.

I’m sure Ethan here is a very nice and woke fellow. But I suspect I would die of a full body eye roll given how earnest he is.

For example, I get the squicks when WH-ite people straightfacedly do the “settler, colonialist” thing without some preamble or something because that itself seems like appropriation or like some kind of performance.

http://www.ethanhein.com/wp/2021/happy-inauguration-day/

I have friends and acquaintances who share this sort of white appreciator earnest love for hip hop and jazz and this reverent hushed tones approach to BIPOC cultural contributions. Which is good that people are willing to take it seriously and appr something not originating from the dominant culture. But it seems unfun and anti-pleasure. And I disagree with some of the essentialist approach about American “blackness” and authenticity and “soul” because it seems to objectify and other while celebrating. (I don’t know if this guy does much of that, but some of the folks I know personally are riding that line.) But it’s something I’m ambivalent about and why I tend to take a “stay in my lane” approach to identity matters by interrogating things from a critical approach to whiteness and maleness and breaking shit down from there. Maybe it’s just wariness because I grew up in a rather diverse social milieu and know first hand the ridiculousness of inappropriate incursions into shit you don’t know about. Being a poser will get you mocked—and rightly, because you look like a fool.

Oh, and he has a SoundCloud!

 

[Flamencology]

I’m not much of a debater. Academically, I’ve been much more of a “yelling fire in a crowded theater” type in terms of finding the weak points in an argument or the soft underbelly of a beloved assumption and then poking it in public. I love a good argument and my approach on panels or when post-presentation Q&A starts tends toward razzle dazzle.

I’m sure Ethan here is a very nice and woke fellow. But I suspect I would die of a full body eye roll given how earnest he is.

For example, I get the squicks when WH-ite people straightfacedly do the “settler, colonialist” thing without some preamble or something because that itself seems like appropriation or like some kind of performance.

http://www.ethanhein.com/wp/2021/happy-inauguration-day/

I have friends and acquaintances who share this sort of white appreciator earnest love for hip hop and jazz and this reverent hushed tones approach to BIPOC cultural contributions. Which is good that people are willing to take it seriously and appr something not originating from the dominant culture. But it seems unfun and anti-pleasure. And I disagree with some of the essentialist approach about American “blackness” and authenticity and “soul” because it seems to objectify and other while celebrating. (I don’t know if this guy does much of that, but some of the folks I know personally are riding that line.) But it’s something I’m ambivalent about and why I tend to take a “stay in my lane” approach to identity matters by interrogating things from a critical approach to whiteness and maleness and breaking shit down from there. Maybe it’s just wariness because I grew up in a rather diverse social milieu and know first hand the ridiculousness of inappropriate incursions into shit you don’t know about. Being a poser will get you mocked—and rightly, because you look like a fool.

Oh, and he has a SoundCloud!

‘Funk at the Zoo’ is a fine song title, but it’s also a song title that insists: ‘This music fucks.”

Mr. Hein’s ‘Funk at the Zoo’ decidedly does not fuck.

 

[Guitar Heel]

Coming from an academic theatre background...

I think that if you’re gonna do theatrics, then do them right and go all in and give it some thought.

I cringe at automated lights, lasers, and smoke machines. I feel like I’m in a bad high school Halloween haunted house.

The Flaming Lips do theatre the right way, IMO.

The OP vid was just silly.

 

[Devil is Dill]

Where does this rank on the "Avril Lavigne mispronouncing 'David Bowie' and Billie Eilish not knowing who Van Halen is" scale?

 

[Peen Simmons]

Where does this rank on the "Avril Lavigne mispronouncing 'David Bowie' and Billie Eilish not knowing who Van Halen is" scale?

I’ll see if I can find it, but Kurt Cobain also mispronounced Bowie’s name during interviews.

 

[shoeless]

I am not familiar with Phoebe Bridgers, but after watching her two performances on SNL, I don't plan on digging into her catalog. John Hiatt, OTOH, is a national treasure.

As far as the guitar smashing goes, that Dano held up well and is ready for round 2. Other than a few relic-ing dings, it didn't seem to suffer much damage. And is it just me, or did the sparks that flew out with the first few hits look like pyrotechnic theatrics? I don't know why sparks would fly from the outside of a wedge monitor when struck with a guitar. If so, that only adds to the lameness of all this, IMO. However, I agree with @Gary Blanchard that it appears to be getting her publicity, so I guess it's a win for her.

 

[Guitar Heel]

I am not familiar with Phoebe Bridgers, but after watching her two performances on SNL, I don't plan on digging into her catalog. John Hiatt, OTOH, is a national treasure.

did the sparks that flew out with the first few hits look like pyrotechnic theatrics? I don't know why sparks would fly from the outside of a wedge monitor when struck with a guitar.

yeah I thought the same

 

[yabba]

A cello would provide a much more dramatic and satisfying smash than a solid-body electric guitar; just saying

 

[Peen Simmons]

It's true. I think this is a weird fantasy. To believe that Phoebe is trying to make some political statement here, which is not really her personality at all.

But also the fantasy of believing that some underprivileged kid who apparently deserves her guitars more than her would do it. Like it's some cheesy 90s disney movie come to life. On top of that the guy doesn't even like guitar himself. "Here kid, here is the dorkiest thing ever besides harpsichord... have fun destroying capitalism for us."

An unrelated note: people are far more condescending to female musicians about this type of stuff. They assume they have never heard music or understand references to things. And need this stuff pointed out that Pete Townshend did the thing or whatever. And that guitars used to be cool and now they suck just in time for when your career rolled around coincidentally! Making his statement ostensibly about poor kids and some fantasy rebellion against capital kind of masks over that.

It's also bitchy to talk about another musician like this to your twitter followers. I mean if you were just making fun of Marilyn Manson right now, okay. But in this case it just comes across as bitchy and bad manners. He is trying to use his twitter clout to hurt her career in some way through canceling.

I think that people have—because it’s been decades—forgotten/misremembered how rock-type pop music works. People have accepted the non-rock narrative that “X changed the world”—a boomer narrative put forth by cultural commentators and some rock critics that conflates the counterculture with THE MOVEMENT in a way that ignores that THE MOVEMENT and the counterculture(s) were often at odds. Specifically Pete Townshend, who popularized guitar smashing as part of an auto destruct Pop Art approach to his beat combo, was super ambivalent about “the revolution” and clearly saw his own Satanic/Luciferian triumph of personal will/expression as the point of his act. I mean, this is the guy who kicked Abby Hoffman (literally) off the stage at Woodstock because it was “my stage” and some other punter could fuck right off for stealing The Who’s limelight.

And punk later muddied the waters. The first wave of NYC punks were pretty apolitical. And the Pistols were part con, part Situationist-inspired gag, and part opportunity for individual musicians to seize agency and do art for their own aggrandizement and pleasure. The Clash kinda dipped a toe into political sloganeering, but they were always a “Revolution? Sure! But first fetch the hair gel” operation. The revolution of punk was aesthetic/stylistic and about changing sensibilities. Any real attempt to do politics was always kinda thick headed.

So it’s kinda dumb to criticize a 4th or 5th generation semi-popular songwriter/performer who has made no political claims re: her work for not bringing about the glorious revolution with three chords and the truth when that was never really what the guitar group moment was about and not really what the “founding fathers” of the counterculture intended—Dylan rejected it and told people to quit sorting through his trash, Lennon was ambivalent about revolution in the lyrics of “Revolution,” Jagger mocked it. All the first wave punks took a very Warhol/Reed cynical approach to hippie sentimentality re: revolution. The UK Class of ‘77 types were mostly just pulling faces for the cameras and pointing out the lameness of the 1960s dinosaurs. Some of the more ideological post-punkers were explicitly “political” but ultimately it was an aesthetic thing.

So, yeah, it’s bonkers to suggest that an artist taking a big swing at getting eyeballs on her work in a pretty hostile-to-artists late capitalist economy is somehow counterrevolutionary because she did a stunt to play to the socials and somehow upset the brown corduroy and locally roasted pour over coffee subset of self-appointed Gen X gatekeepers/scolds.

 

[VoidTerraFirma]

When is someone gonna smash a Keytar?

 

[Mark Wein]

When is someone gonna smash a Keytar?

 

[Guitar Heel]

When is someone gonna smash a Keytar?

in her case, I'd recommend a Casino or 330.

 

[Help!I'maRock!]

I think that people have—because it’s been decades—forgotten/misremembered how rock-type pop music works. People have accepted the non-rock narrative that “X changed the world”—a boomer narrative put forth by cultural commentators and some rock critics that conflates the counterculture with THE MOVEMENT in a way that ignores that THE MOVEMENT and the counterculture(s) were often at odds. Specifically Pete Townshend, who popularized guitar smashing as part of an auto destruct Pop Art approach to his beat combo, was super ambivalent about “the revolution” and clearly saw his own Satanic/Luciferian triumph of personal will/expression as the point of his act. I mean, this is the guy who kicked Abby Hoffman (literally) off the stage at Woodstock because it was “my stage” and some other punter could fuck right off for stealing The Who’s limelight.

And punk later muddied the waters. The first wave of NYC punks were pretty apolitical. And the Pistols were part con, part Situationist-inspired gag, and part opportunity for individual musicians to seize agency and do art for their own aggrandizement and pleasure. The Clash kinda dipped a toe into political sloganeering, but they were always a “Revolution? Sure! But first fetch the hair gel” operation. The revolution of punk was aesthetic/stylistic and about changing sensibilities. Any real attempt to do politics was always kinda thick headed.

So it’s kinda dumb to criticize a 4th or 5th generation semi-popular songwriter/performer who has made no political claims re: her work for not bringing about the glorious revolution with three chords and the truth when that was never really what the guitar group moment was about and not really what the “founding fathers” of the counterculture intended—Dylan rejected it and told people to quit sorting through his trash, Lennon was ambivalent about revolution in the lyrics of “Revolution,” Jagger mocked it. All the first wave punks took a very Warhol/Reed cynical approach to hippie sentimentality re: revolution. The UK Class of ‘77 types were mostly just pulling faces for the cameras and pointing out the lameness of the 1960s dinosaurs. Some of the more ideological post-punkers were explicitly “political” but ultimately it was an aesthetic thing.

So, yeah, it’s bonkers to suggest that an artist taking a big swing at getting eyeballs on her work in a pretty hostile-to-artists late capitalist economy is somehow counterrevolutionary because she did a stunt to play to the socials and somehow upset the brown corduroy and locally roasted pour over coffee subset of self-appointed Gen X gatekeepers/scolds.

Finally.

Shoulda smashed Patrick's SG instead.

 

[VoidTerraFirma]

I can endorse some Banjo smashing.