Teaching songs

AdamLopez

Telewacker
Curious how other teachers feel about this with your average lazy student.

The ones that only want to play monkey see/monkey doo with the tabs and not truly learn about guitar and music.

Do you just babysit them and take their money?

Do you refuse to teach them songs until they reach a certain point and if so, what is that point.

I try and use the song as a vehicle to dig deeper and learn music/guitar theory, but some students are just so ridiculously lazy that I'm wasting my breath.

Thoughts ?
 
I use songs along with whatever book I'm working with to give the student a musical context to apply their lesson to. I refuse to regurgitate songs for new students to learn by rote.

Students who have been with me for a long time I might go through a period of just working on songs with them if we have spent a bunch of time working on what I feel is important and we've reached a point where we need a break but they want to continue lessons.
 
I use songs along with whatever book I'm working with to give the student a musical context to apply their lesson to. I refuse to regurgitate songs for new students to learn by rote.

Students who have been with me for a long time I might go through a period of just working on songs with them if we have spent a bunch of time working on what I feel is important and we've reached a point where we need a break but they want to continue lessons.

This is sort of my approach. I try to keep them motivated by just teaching pieces of songs to use as working examples of concepts I am trying to convey.

Ideally I'm with you on the 2nd point too, and for a good student, that's a great way to work and it's logical.

The not so great student you may lose if you do that though. Do you suck it up and let the student quit? Do you compromise? If so, how?

These types shouldn't even be considered students as by not letting the teacher do his job, they are dictating how things go with a subliminal "the customer is always right" thing which is shit.

One of our teachers is in his 50's and has been teaching FOREVER. Something like 10 different instruments too.

His best advice to me was students must submit.

They must leave any preconceived notions and egos at the door and go with the flow.
 
As a student I disagree with this post intensely. Maybe you have sucky students, but that's no reason to have a sucky attitude. I mean honestly, if you can't come up with a way to impart your lesson inside the context of a song (if that is way that the student is going to learn most successfully) then you are lazier than your students.
 
This is sort of my approach. I try to keep them motivated by just teaching pieces of songs to use as working examples of concepts I am trying to convey.

Ideally I'm with you on the 2nd point too, and for a good student, that's a great way to work and it's logical.

The not so great student you may lose if you do that though. Do you suck it up and let the student quit? Do you compromise? If so, how?

These types shouldn't even be considered students as by not letting the teacher do his job, they are dictating how things go with a subliminal "the customer is always right" thing which is shit.

One of our teachers is in his 50's and has been teaching FOREVER. Something like 10 different instruments too.

His best advice to me was students must submit.

They must leave any preconceived notions and egos at the door and go with the flow.

As a student I disagree with this post intensely. Maybe you have sucky students, but that's no reason to have a sucky attitude. I mean honestly, if you can't come up with a way to impart your lesson inside the context of a song (if that is way that the student is going to learn most successfully) then you are lazier than your students.


I think the thing that it took me a long time to figure out is that most students that I have come to me through word of mouth or reputation...they are usually with the "program" from the beginning but ultimately everyone has a different reason and a different level of motivation for playing. I really have to gauge where the student is at and roll with it over the long term. I have students for 3-5 years sometimes and we go through phases where we work hard on what can be considered "constructive" learning and other times we are just enjoying playing some music that is still pushing them in the right direction but takes some of the stress off. My students that gig or are getting ready for or are in music school get a bit more of a push but in the end my students are also my customers. If I was teaching in a university it would be a different story.

I teach a ton of adults and many of them are just using the lessons as an escape from every day life. I'm definitely cheaper than therapy :embarrassed:
 
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I think the thing that it took me a long time to figure out is that most students that I have come to me through word of mouth or reputation...they are usually with the "program" from the beginning

Sure - if the student is there for the "Mark Wein Experience" then by all means, give them the "Mark Wein Experience".

I teach a ton of adults and many of them are just using the lessons as an escape from every day life. I'm definitely cheaper than therapy :embarrassed:

Depends on your health insurance. :grin:
 
As a student I disagree with this post intensely. Maybe you have sucky students, but that's no reason to have a sucky attitude. I mean honestly, if you can't come up with a way to impart your lesson inside the context of a song (if that is way that the student is going to learn most successfully) then you are lazier than your students.

Sucky attitude?
 
I'm still trying to figure out how my attitude is "sucky" and how I've yet to "come up with a way to impart your lesson inside the context of a song"
 
I'm still trying to figure out how my attitude is "sucky" and how I've yet to "come up with a way to impart your lesson inside the context of a song"

You guys get to (politely) work that out on your own.

I will say that my attitude changed quite a bit about the subject once I had to start paying for the building :embarrassed:
 
These types shouldn't even be considered students as by not letting the teacher do his job, they are dictating how things go with a subliminal "the customer is always right" thing which is shit.

:shrug:

Anyway, no biggie - the relationship you have with your students is none of my business.

Carry on.
 
:shrug:

Anyway, no biggie - the relationship you have with your students is none of my business.

Carry on.

Think of it from a teacher's point of view. A student comes to a teacher for help. Student says, I would like to learn "this, this, and this".

Teacher evaluates where said student is in his/her development.

Teacher recommends what is deemed necessary to achieve student's goals.

Student refuses to follow lesson plan instead thinking it logical to just learn songs from some tabs.

By doing said student is passive aggressively "driving the bus" and therefore not submitting and therefore assuming that he or she knows more than said teacher (or just plain lying to his/her self about his/her goals). Hence, taking the "customer is always right" approach.

No "sucky" attitudes, just hypothetical conversation based on real world experience.

In elementary school, only teachers were allowed in the "teacher's lounge" so they could talk smack on the bratty little students they had to deal with.

What gives Wein?? :lol:
 
i will teach a student anything if it gets the point across to them. and if that is Green Day songs, then so be it. i can talk about the things i need to in the context of the song. if they then won't practice that, i have no problem making their life a living hell. because now i've agreed to what they want. live up to your end of the bargain, and don't waste my time.
 
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