Question: Lennon or McCartney?

Lennon or McCartney?

  • Total voters
    24
frunobulax said:
there is no worse song than Wonderful Christmas Time.

It is the worst there ever was, the worst there is, and the worst there ever will be.

it is the standard against which all that is bad is measured.
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I'll see that and raise you one "Freedom".
 
Rick 381 said:
In "Lennon" Cynthia says John hit her ONCE in 1958 felt so bad about it he cried when he apologized. She said he never hit her again. But I guess his wife wouldn't know if he was a wife beater or not.

But apparently it bothered John enough that he did it in the 50's that he felt sorry about it for the rest of his life.
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I hope the Beatleologists Association don't get wind of this:

LENNON: It is a diary form of writing. All that "I used to be cruel to my woman, I beat her and kept her apart from the things that she loved" was me. I used to be cruel to my woman, and physically -- any woman. I was a hitter. I couldn't express myself and I hit. I fought men and I hit women. That is why I am always on about peace, you see. It is the most violent people who go for love and peace. Everything's the opposite. But I sincerely believe in love and peace. I am not violent man who has learned not to be violent and regrets his violence. I will have to be a lot older before I can face in public how I treated women as a youngster.
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Rick 381 said:
Never argue Beatles with a Beatleologist.
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You're a Beatleologist in yer fuckin' dreams.

http://listverse.com/2012/05/12/top-10-unpleasant-facts-about-john-lennon/

"There’s simply no way of disputing this: the revered icon of peace and love had a serious problem with violence against women. This has been documented all the way back to his Liverpool days, and he eventually admitted it himself later in life. His first wife Cynthia and his second, Yoko Ono, were both victims of Lennon’s brutality at one point or another, and given that most men who beat their spouses or girlfriends regularly are not particularly discriminating about the object of their violence, it’s frankly impossible that they were the only ones. It seems clear in hindsight that the gentle icon the hippies worship was actually a man with very serious psychological problems who often flew into uncontrollable fits of rage which he took out on the women in his life."

http://www.reddit.com/r/todayilearned/comments/1af1io/til_that_john_lennon_beat_his_wife_and/

"But he wasn't just violent against women. According to some biographers, Lennon suffered feelings of extreme guilt when his friend Stu Sutcliffe died of a brain hemorrhage. Two weeks before he and Lennon had gotten into a fight and Lennon reportedly kicked him in the head with a steel-toed boot. (He always blamed himself for Sutcliffe's death at 23.) Lennon would also get into street fights. (Experts on the Beatles said that that was the big irony between the Stones and the Beatles. The public thinks of the Stones as "street-fighting men" when in reality Mick Jagger was a wimpy guy and a bookish business major, while Lennon was the actual roughneck who engaged in literal street fights.

But getting back to Lennon's abusiveness as it pertained to women . . .

The article overlooked an incident where Lennon slapped a lady journalist across the face in 1964. Reporter Larry Kane writes about it in his book. (He accompanied the Beatles on their first tour of America.) It required a lot of diplomacy and public relations skills from Brian Epstein to suppress the story."

http://www.recmusicbeatles.com/public/files/bbs/jl_yo.playboy/lennon4.html

"I used to be cruel to my woman, and physically -- any woman. I was a hitter. I couldn't express myself and I hit. I fought men and I hit women."

http://www.cracked.com/article_20469_5-beloved-celebrities-who-were-nothing-like-you-think.html

"Lennon was a real asshole, especially to the people he was supposed to love the most. While he did write classic peace songs like "Imagine" and "Give Peace a Chance," keep in mind that he also wrote "I Am the Walrus," so he did not possess the soundest of minds. Lennon admitted in a Playboy interview that when he was younger, he basically went around punching women: "I was a hitter. I couldn't express myself and I hit. I fought men and I hit women."

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He flashes the peace sign a lot because it's the easiest way to go for the eyes.

His attitude didn't change much when he hooked up with Yoko Ono and started shouting about peace. People gave Ono a lot of shit for following Lennon to band practices (a taboo in the music world known as "being a Yoko Ono"), but Ono only did that because Lennon demanded that she come out of fear she would leave him. He even made her go into the bathroom with him, afraid someone would snatch her away while she waited in the lobby. At the same time, he was openly unfaithful to her, just as he was to his first wife.

In the end, though, the biggest target of Lennon's cruelty was his son Julian. Lennon was absent for most of Julian's life, and the time he spent with him often led to yelling, insults, and very uncomfortable situations.

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"But Dad, I'm afraid of bears."
"I know, child. I know."

Lennon stated in an interview that Julian was unplanned and "came from a bottle of whiskey." Lennon did admit his failings near the end of his life, but he added, "I will have to be a lot older before I can face in public how I treated women as a youngster." Sadly, that didn't happen, so he died an asshole."

What a guy.
 
So aside from the diarrhea strewn about this thread, the poll results are interesting. It looks like McCartney's in the lead by a margin of about two to one. That's opposite of the original video I posted. I'd say it's because this is a musician board, but most of the folks in the video are musicians.
 
smurfco said:
So aside from the diarrhea strewn about this thread, the poll results are interesting. It looks like McCartney's in the lead by a margin of about two to one. That's opposite of the original video I posted. I'd say it's because this is a musician board, but most of the folks in the video are musicians.
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You can call it diarrhea, but guys hitting women is simply uncool. I don't care how deep, acerbic, and quick witted you think Lennon is.
 
Tralfaz said:
I think, for example, that people tend to credit John with more of the experimental sounds of the Beatles, whereas Paul (by John's own admission) was the one pushing harder for that, even on John's tunes (which John called "subconscious sabotage" by Paul).

And there's the notion that John was the rocker and Paul was the cutesy one. Yeah, Paul did a lot of twee stuff like "Honey Pie" and "When I'm 64," but he also recorded things like "Helter Skelter."



That's a matter of opinion. I thought Tug of War, his first LP after John's death was one of his best solo efforts. And I still listen to Run Devil Run and Chaos and Creation from time to time. And his Fireman tracks are pretty interesting too, although it's hard to tell how much is Macca and how much is Youth.
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Undoubtedly a matter of opinion and not that I need to justify, but I wasn't talking immediately I was talking over the course of few albums. I love Tug of War and loved a bunch of the Wings stuff. My dad was pretty big Beatles fan and bought and regularly played all of their solo albums for up through the mid-eighties or so. The work of the members of the Beatles is a huge part of the soundtrack of my life. And again, I voted for Paul so it's not like I don't think he's awesome, I just think history shows that the vast majority of his best material was produced during Lennon's lifetime...and I speculate that it is not a coincidence.
 
Gary Blanchard said:
I won't deny that Paul could rock, and pushed boundaries. All I am saying is that there was too much cutesy stuff that didn't resonate with me. All a matter of personal taste, and mine can be quite odd.

I think that their personalities were quite different, and it really shows in post-Beatle output. I think Paul wanted to put out music that would appeal to the masses and John just did what he wanted not worrying about the acceptance. I'm not saying one is better than the other, but they are different and get different results.
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I don't know that Paul wanted to put out any particular type of music, but I know he felt he still had something to say and a big things was that he wanted to actually play concerts. This was seemingly something that John wasn't interested in for some time and was a part of the reason for split. Obviously there were a ton of variables, but each one was important to someone. Back to the music, I think Paul had a more natural inclination towards accessibility as did John, but Lennon's was more raw.

George was the guy that really wasn't trying to do anything other than follow his muse...as least from my perspective. His two most accessible tunes were rather derivative (we all know about the My Sweet Lord lawsuit, but Here Comes the Sun was really just a twist on Holly's Baby Baby), but most of his other stuff within the Beatles and early solo career were stretching ears far more than John or Paul were seemingly capable of.
 
Tiltsta said:
Hard to choose, as they both did their best stuff working together. I guess if I had to pick one of them it would be McCartney.
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I agree with this wholeheartedly, but knowing the primary writer for given tunes...McCartney's stuff is still my favorite. That said, Hey Bulldog is one of the best tunes they ever did. Lennon's tune through and through, except for Paul's killer bass playing and great backup vocals.
 
Dogsinotpalc said:
I just think history shows that the vast majority of his best material was produced during Lennon's lifetime...and I speculate that it is not a coincidence.
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Paul wrote great material after the Beatles broke up, when Lennon was still alive, and they stopped hanging out.
 
Acadiafall said:
I think Lennon would come out on top. Possibly not on a musician led forum (but also there maybe too) but on a public one im sure he would
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That's true of the US public, too. Every third college dorm room has a John Lennon poster up in it. There hasn't been a market for Paul posters since '64.
 
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